This one for LogicalFrank, but unfortunately I can add a couple of names to it too. Go ahead Frank, places not to play, and the reaons why not.
that one place in philly, fuck them.
Yeah and that one place in Cincinnati blows too.
Oh jesus and that one in Portland. You know the one
My list would be huge, but most of the shitty ones end up closing or changing management faster than you can blacklist em.
Locally, The Comet for me. Others like it tho i guess. some people dont mind having to park and load in four blocks away from the club and playing for $8 and two free Hamms that the bartender wont give you until 9pm even tho you were told to be there at 7pm for a sound check that never happened..but Im not one of those people. again ....its probably changed management since then anyway.
$8 and 2 free hamms would be a good night for most of my bands..was that each?? or did you have to split it with the other guys..either way, good gig.
Just Bill's in Overland, MO. The sound is awful, except for the house band, that contains the son of the house engineer, which sounded pretty good for Iron Maiden wannabes. They stuck us on stage before doors even opened (so the house band could get a set, they weren't scheduled to play that night) and we were finished 15 minutes after they opened, before the bunch of people that came to see us even got into the place.
Smiling Moose, Pittsburgh. Been awhile since i have played there but hear the same shit from others in the area.The number one reason to avoid that place is the sound guy. The sound guy sucks in every respect and somehow is in charge of the shows which only adds to the fact that he sucks. I believe my whole band made $25 total the last time i played there and there is no free drinks. Parking is a bitch and you have to be there 3 hours before the show even starts. That being said i saw Fu Manchu play there and it was great.
"Just Bills" ....is that the name of the club? "hey Bill , what you gonna name your new bar?" ''Fuck it i dunno, "Just Bills" i guess?"
People here on the local craigs list are always posting ads that say "Musicians: Dont play at Bubbas in Pfife!"...really? no shit? a place named Bubbas sucks? who the hell woulda figured that one out in advance? ??? Its in Pfife? a fucking trailor park community? and it sucked? the audience was hookers and meth heads more intersted in pull tabs and scoring rox than your band? I am shocked, fucking SHOCKED! whats that? they didnt pay your Allman Bros cover band after you brought in 10 people (your girlfriends and their one fat friend each) to their skeezoid club? but you put up 1000's of flyers! you had a smoke machine and everything.! You brough tyour own soundman and lighting rigs, how could they do that to you, who woulda guessed? Bubba himself is a fat greasy asshole who rips off his bands and his customers and tried to hit on your underage daughter? NO! not a person named Bubba, never, that could never happen! shocking! :o not in Pfife!
i dont get it....dont be surprised if your gig at "We Rape Bands Buttholes Tavern and Show Palace" in ManBoyRapeville USA leaves you with a swollen anus.
Dont be surprised when "McShittys PBRdome" in Suckatucky, Asshio only serves warm stale PBR
dont be surprised when you play at "Swindlers" and get swindled outn of your pay, etc etc.
Hey, not all Bubba's are bad news, there's a local guy round here that legally changed his name to Bubba Bubba Bubba, has it on the sunscreen on his TransAm and everything, even made the papers.
(http://dub.greboguru.org/bubbabubbabubba.jpg)
Oops, that's a NIssan, not a Trans-Am :)
:D :D :D
okay that guy may be awesome and all, but would you play his bar and expect to get paid or not to have to drink piss warm hamms all night?
"sorry guys, I had to pay the soundman (who never showed up), the door guy (who sat and drank at the bar all night) , and besides my yugo needs a personalized sunscreeen that says 'bubba bubba bubba" on it so Ive only got $8.50 for you six guys to split. I will make it up to you next time, you guys are great!"
Hey, you expect to get paid for this? Round here you only get paid if you a f--n cover band, I made more money runnin' sound for Gzus's other (cover) band, than I ever do in Hemi.
There were a few other places on my shitlist, like the place that made us pay the first $75 of the door to the soundguy, who wouldn't even put my bass in the PA (fuck him, I just turned it up), but thankfully that places, and others like it, have all have since closed.
hemi, we've played places like that before too. it is hard to find places in the middle of IL that want to hear original music. luckily there are a few, but most want either tight pants indie rock (which we are not) or nu/death/black metal (which we aren't). lose/lose.
I think, if they'd been allowed to hear us, the audience might have dug it. Just Bill's gets a good 'heavy rock' type crowd in, it was the fact the sound guy obviously played favourites with his kids band, the reason they were on the bill, was their gig for that night somewhere else had fallen through, and we got the short straw.
If you're in a big enough band to demand your own engineer gets to run sound, and your put on at the right time, it would be an OK place. Most places though the sound engineers are territorial, I'm sorry but just because you had the spare cash to buy all this shit, doesn't mean you are anywhere near qualified to run it. That's the case in way too many places.
Quote from: Hemisaurus on May 10, 2011, 04:11:20 PM
I'm sorry but just because you had the spare cash to buy all this shit, doesn't mean you are anywhere near qualified to run it. That's the case in way too many places.
perfect. they should make people sign forms that say this before they are allowed to take possession of their behringer mixer, phonic power amps and nady speakers . . .
No, this was nice stuff. JBL speakers, Crest power amps and the like. What made it such a shame that it was wasted :'(
I expect to get paid yes. I doesnt need to be alot, but $20 split 4 ways is not acceptable.
I expect to not have to drink goat piss with my measly 2 drink tickets, you will serve me the beer of my choice and honor my drink ticket or I will drink two of your shitty beers wiht those drink tickets , pack up my crap and walk out before the shows starts. (ive done that twice now..it cost me being a band once, no big loss tho they can stay and drink goatpiss if they want, not me).
I expect to arrive at the bar when it is time for work, not four hours before hand for a supposed "soundcheck" only to find your dumbass soundguy didnt show or that you "dont do soundchecks"..wtf? why tell me to come early for one then?
I expect to be able to park near the bar or at least be able to load in from near the bar, not from 5 blocks away cause you have NO parking, fuck you then you shouldnt have bands.
thats about it. i dont think its asking too much. I play a few less gigs than I otherwise would, but those gigs wouldve been completely shitty anyway. Id rather stay at home with my bong, good beers and bigscreen tv then go out, find parking, put wear and tear on my gear and end up paying money to play a shitty gig while having to drink piss for my pay.
shit when I was 21 i would play anywhere for any amount under any circumstances. now, not so much.
speaking of drink tickets, all you genius fucking bar owners can suck my dick for only giving me two per gig.
the laugh is on you.
http://www.amazon.com/Coin-Tainer-Co-Double-Assorted-60670-63765/dp/B002S0OBU0/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1305068541&sr=8-7 (http://www.amazon.com/Coin-Tainer-Co-Double-Assorted-60670-63765/dp/B002S0OBU0/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1305068541&sr=8-7)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51aahPt571L._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
Quote from: Chovie D on May 10, 2011, 06:54:26 PM
I expect to get paid yes. I doesnt need to be alot, but $20 split 4 ways is not acceptable.
I expect to not have to drink goat piss with my measly 2 drink tickets, you will serve me the beer of my choice and honor my drink ticket or I will drink two of your shitty beers wiht those drink tickets , pack up my crap and walk out before the shows starts. (ive done that twice now..it cost me being a band once, no big loss tho they can stay and drink goatpiss if they want, not me).
I expect to arrive at the bar when it is time for work, not four hours before hand for a supposed "soundcheck" only to find your dumbass soundguy didnt show or that you "dont do soundchecks"..wtf? why tell me to come early for one then?
I expect to be able to park near the bar or at least be able to load in from near the bar, not from 5 blocks away cause you have NO parking, fuck you then you shouldnt have bands.
thats about it. i dont think its asking too much. I play a few less gigs than I otherwise would, but those gigs wouldve been completely shitty anyway. Id rather stay at home with my bong, good beers and bigscreen tv then go out, find parking, put wear and tear on my gear and end up paying money to play a shitty gig while having to drink piss for my pay.
shit when I was 21 i would play anywhere for any amount under any circumstances. now, not so much.
You just described the music scene around here...unless you are a "bar" band. Anyway Chovie I agree with you 100% but I still go out and do it anyway. LAst gig i did (over 1 year ago btw) we were paid nothing, started an hour and a half late because of a sound guy's decision to watch a hockey game, and got zero free drinks! That gets old really fast!
i still do it when i can..i just like playing out and it doesnt come along often, so i dont turn much down..
The Phantasy night club in Cleveland is a bad one. I've talked to guys who like it OK, but most hate it. No drink specials, street parking and loading in up several flights of stairs blows. Never got paid a dime there either. The first time I played there the sound guy was good, the other three or four times not so much.
Quote from: Chovie D on May 10, 2011, 06:54:26 PM
I expect to get paid yes. I doesnt need to be alot, but $20 split 4 ways is not acceptable.
I expect to not have to drink goat piss with my measly 2 drink tickets, you will serve me the beer of my choice and honor my drink ticket or I will drink two of your shitty beers wiht those drink tickets , pack up my crap and walk out before the shows starts. (ive done that twice now..it cost me being a band once, no big loss tho they can stay and drink goatpiss if they want, not me).
I expect to arrive at the bar when it is time for work, not four hours before hand for a supposed "soundcheck" only to find your dumbass soundguy didnt show or that you "dont do soundchecks"..wtf? why tell me to come early for one then?
I expect to be able to park near the bar or at least be able to load in from near the bar, not from 5 blocks away cause you have NO parking, fuck you then you shouldnt have bands.
thats about it. i dont think its asking too much. I play a few less gigs than I otherwise would, but those gigs wouldve been completely shitty anyway. Id rather stay at home with my bong, good beers and bigscreen tv then go out, find parking, put wear and tear on my gear and end up paying money to play a shitty gig while having to drink piss for my pay.
shit when I was 21 i would play anywhere for any amount under any circumstances. now, not so much.
Not sure that's worth burning your bandmates over...
Quote from: Chovie D on May 10, 2011, 03:54:26 PM
:D :D :D
okay that guy may be awesome and all, but would you play his bar and expect to get paid or not to have to drink piss warm hamms all night?
"sorry guys, I had to pay the soundman (who never showed up), the door guy (who sat and drank at the bar all night) , and besides my yugo needs a personalized sunscreeen that says 'bubba bubba bubba" on it so Ive only got $8.50 for you six guys to split. I will make it up to you next time, you guys are great!"
Ok all fun and games aside. that is not a Trans Am or a Yugo. That is a Nissan 350Z in Bubba Blue
Is there really any such thing as a place "not to play"? I mean, doing the shittiest is all part of the experience, isn't it?
"character building" and all that crap
For a lot of us, it's only the very worst venues that are gonna make us feel like we've gotten somewhere. I mean, I know I feel pretty good that I now play a better class of shithole.
Quote from: Chovie D on May 10, 2011, 06:54:26 PM
I expect to get paid yes. I doesnt need to be alot, but $20 split 4 ways is not acceptable.
I expect to not have to drink goat piss with my measly 2 drink tickets, you will serve me the beer of my choice and honor my drink ticket or I will drink two of your shitty beers wiht those drink tickets , pack up my crap and walk out before the shows starts. (ive done that twice now..it cost me being a band once, no big loss tho they can stay and drink goatpiss if they want, not me).
I expect to arrive at the bar when it is time for work, not four hours before hand for a supposed "soundcheck" only to find your dumbass soundguy didnt show or that you "dont do soundchecks"..wtf? why tell me to come early for one then?
I expect to be able to park near the bar or at least be able to load in from near the bar, not from 5 blocks away cause you have NO parking, fuck you then you shouldnt have bands.
thats about it. i dont think its asking too much. I play a few less gigs than I otherwise would, but those gigs wouldve been completely shitty anyway. Id rather stay at home with my bong, good beers and bigscreen tv then go out, find parking, put wear and tear on my gear and end up paying money to play a shitty gig while having to drink piss for my pay.
shit when I was 21 i would play anywhere for any amount under any circumstances. now, not so much.
Fucking Hell ya What Chovie D said!
Quote from: Discö Fist on May 16, 2011, 08:13:27 PM
Quote from: Chovie D on May 10, 2011, 06:54:26 PM
I expect to get paid yes. I doesnt need to be alot, but $20 split 4 ways is not acceptable.
I expect to not have to drink goat piss with my measly 2 drink tickets, you will serve me the beer of my choice and honor my drink ticket or I will drink two of your shitty beers wiht those drink tickets , pack up my crap and walk out before the shows starts. (ive done that twice now..it cost me being a band once, no big loss tho they can stay and drink goatpiss if they want, not me).
I expect to arrive at the bar when it is time for work, not four hours before hand for a supposed "soundcheck" only to find your dumbass soundguy didnt show or that you "dont do soundchecks"..wtf? why tell me to come early for one then?
I expect to be able to park near the bar or at least be able to load in from near the bar, not from 5 blocks away cause you have NO parking, fuck you then you shouldnt have bands.
thats about it. i dont think its asking too much. I play a few less gigs than I otherwise would, but those gigs wouldve been completely shitty anyway. Id rather stay at home with my bong, good beers and bigscreen tv then go out, find parking, put wear and tear on my gear and end up paying money to play a shitty gig while having to drink piss for my pay.
shit when I was 21 i would play anywhere for any amount under any circumstances. now, not so much.
Not sure that's worth burning your bandmates over...
I asked them to leave with me. i told em if a place was gonna treat us ike crap when we were working for them it wasnt worth playing there and we should cut our losses and leave now. One band told me the next day i was right and said they wished they had left too. the other one fired me. It worked out well for me because I ended up playing gigs I wanted to play rather than being frustrated playing shitty gigs and being treated like shit. Im not trying to be a hardass, I just reached a point where it wasnt worth taking peoples shit anymore. Like I said when i was younger I wouldve just played the show, but IM old and cranky and tired now. One club told us to show up at 7 in an email. we get there and they say come back at 9, theres a private party goin on till then. That time the whole band went home and didnt come back..there are limits to what you tolerate and this can be a good thing Ive found. By elavating yourself above that level of shit you are assuring yourself either better gigs or no gigs. either way, less frustrating than shitty gigs.
lemme ask you all something. when you play a shitty gig and are treated like crap and have NO funn and dont get paid...does it not just make you look at your $1000's of dollars of equipment and think of all the time, money and energy you put into your music and then ask yourself..."what the fuck am I doing this for?" ???
Id rather not feel that way about something I love so much, so I try not to put myself in that situation if possible anymore.
sorry to hear about the phantasy in clevo, that was the place with the boat in the middle of the bar. i liked to party in that little cubby hole cabin thing in the boat. The Euclid Tavern was always our favorite in Cleveland..i heard they tore it down?
Quote from: Chovie D on May 17, 2011, 09:55:39 AM
lemme ask you all something. when you play a shitty gig and are treated like crap and have NO funn and dont get paid...does it not just make you look at your $1000's of dollars of equipment and think of all the time, money and energy you put into your music and then ask yourself..."what the fuck am I doing this for?" ???
Precisely the reason I try not to spend thousands of dollars on equipment, I can either think I'm a struggling musician who spends more than he gets paid, or that I play music for fun, and don't expect to get back financially what I put in, so maybe I don't make enough to justify that $800 guitar and that $1000 amplifier and then $300 on a $15 distortion box that's been built by hand.
I agree with you wholeheartedly, though as regards the no more shitty gigs, but I don't judge it by we get paid, or how many drink tickets we get. I judge it more by how we're treated. Like Aretha said R-E-S-P-E-C-T ;)
Im with you, the $1000's is over the course of twenty years. These days I am hauling about $2K worth to a gig, $1100 of that would be pedal steel $400 amp, $300 guitar and easily $200 in effects, steel seat, bar etc.
and yes, for me too it really boils down to RESPECT, but not paying me when I was promised pay is a form of disrespect to me, so in that sense, money matters to me. The respect part certainly matters more than the $25 itself...i am gonna spend that tipping your bartenders anyway.
since we are talking shitty gigs let me flip it for a second:
One of the best gigs out there is the college gig. You are paid via the mandatory student activity fees they pay with their tuition and so it pays very very well. The gig is usually during daylight hours and packed with young women, and since the students are your booker and promoter, and since the money they are spening is not 'theirs', they treat you like a king, tons of food, no dicking you around, etc. Its harder to get the big UNiversity gigs, but there are a TON of smaller colleges, community colleges and stuff. The students are enthusiastic and energetic (and horny). Play three or four over the course of a spring and youve got enough money for your band to record a full length album :)
MAN i can picture so many but can't remember names that well.
one is in tallahassee, think is either big daddy's or spanky's - im pretty sure. the promoter/or bar manager saw us at the liquor store prior one of our shows there, then when we were apparently "late" for load in (we were the second band there) he wouldn't give us space for merch or gear, no drink tickets and were only allowed a couple waters. he did however give us tons of shit about seeing us earlier. i mean he must not have understood that the liquor store would have been totally closed by the time the show was over, so we had to stock up prior, DUUUUHHHH - totally ridiculous.
i'll think of some more...
We had a pretty shitty experience at The Note in West Chester,PA. Seems like people are 50/50 on this place. I have a few friends who's bands play there every few months or so, and they seem to be pretty cool with it. I've also talked to a few other people that shared our experience. The people that work there were pretty dick-ish to us. There was a pretty decent turn out, though. Bam owns the place so I think a lot of poeple go there just to say the did. It had opened fairly recently at that time, though. So, things might have changed.
thats really the bottom line. If the people working the place are dickish to you, it is not a good place to play. If the staff/owners/bookers treat you like gold..it doesnt matter if the place is a dump or has a shitty PA, its a good place to play.
It doesnt seem too hard or too expensive to train your staff to be nice to,and respectful of, the bands(who are actually for that night, their fellow employees , not some enemy that needs to be denied respect,pay and beer). Its not going to break the bars profit margin to serve the band Redhook rather than Hamms. It doesnt take muhc to call or email a band and let them no the show is canceled BEFORE they haul their gear down, etc. Its easy...therefor the only conclusion I can draw is some people are just fucking assdholes. i remember who they are...and i dont go back for more.
yeah man that shit about only giving you the shit beer with your drink tickets screams lack of respect. I'm not showing up with my Peavey Backstage and a Hondo. I'm showing up with my badass gear and I want a fucking Lagunitas. It aint gonna kill ya.
I heard this analogy a while back. It might have been on the old site but think about it.
The club has a plumbing problem, they call out a plumber. They pay him for driving there (Service call charge), they pay him his hourly rate (probably about 70 bucks an hour). He doesn't have to show up 3 hours before he works on the shit, he's not expected to bring 25 friends to cheer him on and drink at the bar and they pay him without question or hassle. If my band showed up without anybody and didn't do anything but drink at the bar for free, it still wouldn't amount to what they paid that guy to fix the shitter. It's about respect. We're working too.
I too am old and tired. Been doing this for 25 years. I try to be a little choosey nowadays. there's plenty of 20somethings out there that will play a Sunday or Tuesday night for shit. Not me.