my faded SG needs to go

liquidsmoke · December 07, 2011, 05:09:48 AM

It's my E tuned rock guitar and I am sick of it's thick neck and mild neck heavy characteristic. Have a Stetsbar trem(awesome) on it which I will remove so it's replacement needs to be compatible with that unit. I have no idea if an ESP LTD EC-10 or one those 10 pound Agile LPs would fit it. I'm not sure I want a 10 pound guitar for E tuning anyway.

So I'm thinking about getting one of these through Craigslist or Guitar Center- http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/epiphone-les-paul-special-ii-electric-guitar

I know it's the type of guitar parents buy their 10 year olds and that doesn't bother me. I have the Junior version with a Super Distortion which is my dedicated low tuned heavy metal axe and it's fine for that purpose although the input jack needed to be replaced because it was junk.

Perhaps there are other inexpensive models I am overlooking though? I think if you avoid lemons cheap guitars can play and sound fine with a bit of work and upgrades. This would just be for diddling around with psychedelic and heavy rock ideas, nothing serious at the moment. I really want to stick with the Stetsbar trem. I've been down the Strat route before and while I like them, using the trem bar is kind of like wrestling an oversprung robot cock where as the Stets is extremely easy.

Thoughts? Recommendations? Anyone else regret buying a guitar with a baseball bat neck? I did get about 8 years of use out of it at least. It's got some nice Sperzel locking tuners on it too but since the headstock had to be modified for the install those are staying on.

Metal and Beer · December 07, 2011, 05:19:31 AM

Noooo, those are pretty bunk for intermediate or better players. (they're great for beginners). I've owned (or bandmates owned) every model level of Epiphones over the last several years and the next level up are much better, and barely more expensive. (and the high-end ones are sweeeeeet)

Your Mileage May Vary, just my opinion/experience, try before you buy, etc

Edit:...and yeah man I hate the faded SG's for mostly the same reasons you do, and I'll add sharp, rough fret ends and noisy electronics

liquidsmoke · December 07, 2011, 05:41:02 AM

Quote from: Metal and Beer on December 07, 2011, 05:19:31 AM
Noooo, those are pretty bunk for intermediate or better players. (they're great for beginners). I've owned (or bandmates owned) every model level of Epiphones over the last several years and the next level up are much better, and barely more expensive. (and the high-end ones are sweeeeeet)

Your Mileage May Vary, just my opinion/experience, try before you buy, etc

Edit:...and yeah man I hate the faded SG's for mostly the same reasons you do, and I'll add sharp, rough fret ends and noisy electronics

In some ways I don't really even qualify as an intermediate player.

What don't you like about them? My Epi Junior seems fine($88 brand new!) although I'm always using loads of Laney distortion with it and it's tuned down to G so...

The next Epi Paul level up is the "100" model and it's at least $80 more I think and if I'm going to spend that kind of money it would be a pity not to get an Agile although the Epi 100 may be closer to the weight of the Special II. An Agile Paul would be great for my metal stuff but I'd want a really wide strap for one of those bad boys, lately my shoulder has been getting pissed off from the mild weight of the Junior. Arg. Maybe it's a nerve pinch? Anyway.

The Stets compatibility issue severely limits what I can buy but I love the thing for attempted Blue Cheer/Hendrix dive bombs and weird noises, long airplane flying into the distance sounds, etc..

VOLVO))) · December 07, 2011, 11:08:46 AM

I'll give you 169+shipping for that SG, hahaha.

Instant Dan · December 07, 2011, 12:03:09 PM

Call me crazy but I love that baseball neck on my Gothic SG, I guess because it was the first real electric I got.

Lumpy · December 07, 2011, 12:12:50 PM

I tried a faded SG in Guitar Center once -- it seemed light (I'm a bass player though) and the fret ends were fine.

liquidsmoke · December 07, 2011, 01:24:44 PM

The frets on mine are fine and yes it is pretty light. The day I bought it at a local store I went with my boss at the time who had been playing since the '60s. We played almost every brown faded SG the place had to find the best sounding one although it does have bit of a blemish in the finish which is going to make it harder to sell. Doh.

Lumpy · December 07, 2011, 05:38:47 PM

Quote from: liquidsmoke on December 07, 2011, 01:24:44 PM
The frets on mine are fine and yes it is pretty light.

I thought you said it was 10 pounds in the first post, but now I realize you were talking about a possible Agile (doh!). No wonder that didn't make any sense, me don't read good.

Those faded SGs seem like pretty good guitars, I don't know why you're looking to downgrade to the cheapest Epiphones, unless you need the $$... or you don't like SGs. Which would be weird, and sad.

Baltar · December 07, 2011, 05:41:16 PM

Price? Pics?

Lumpy · December 07, 2011, 05:45:09 PM

What will make it harder to sell is the holes from the tremelo, after you pull it out.

VOLVO))) · December 07, 2011, 06:18:08 PM

Yup. What's the price? If you just don't like to profile, just pay me to change it...

liquidsmoke · December 08, 2011, 12:28:23 AM

I like my SG but I don't like the massive neck and how it's somewhat neck heavy. Life is too short, going to get something else.

No mods for the stetsbar install aside from having to get the pick guard cut somewhat. I will probably get a new pick guard for the sale.

Read about them, they rule-
http://stetsbar.com/features.html

No idea on price yet. If anyone wants to make me an offer go ahead but I've never shipped a guitar and I wouldn't know where to get the right size box. I paid $550 new about 8 years ago for it and it's got Sperzel locking tuners although when tuning the strings sometimes catch at the nut a bit but I'm used to it and think it's minor.

Yeah it's silly to buy a cheap Epi to replace it but those are light, they have relatively fast necks, and my trem should fit it. I'll be in Guitar Center very soon to fool around and inspect various guitars. If the Epi 100 model has a thin neck and doesn't weigh as much as a Gibson LP I might go with one of those but I would do so knowing that I could get a much higher quality Agile for about the same price or less. I should probably just do that and suck up the 10 pound weight, what am I some sort of little girl for fuck's sake??!! Look at, read about, and listen to this fucking thing!-

http://www.rondomusic.com/al20003tsspalted.html

$179.95(plus shipping)?! What?

God damnit I want that guitar. I have no idea how thick the neck is though. This info doesn't help me out at all-

# Width of the neck at the nut: 1 5/8"; at the 22st fret: 2 3/16"
# Neck Taper is 21.5 mm at the 1st fret and 23.5 mm at the 12th fret
# Thickness of neck at the first fret approx 11/16"

Anyone have one of these? How thick does the neck feel relative to Gibsons? Or faded SGs in particular?

Also, I don't know how it being an archtop would effect my stetsbar trem either or whether the stets would actually fit on it, I am not assuming that Agile paul bridges are exactly the same as bridges on Gibsons and Epiphones. I will email stets about it. You bastards might have me playing a 10 pound guitar, damn you!

Lumpy · December 08, 2011, 06:22:47 AM

Get a shipping box at Guitar Center... ESPECIALLY if you are making a purchase (they should have a free one for you).

Also, furniture stores are good places to get boxes (may take a little bit of cutting/resizing).

If you ship, get a padded gig bag (used one, if possible) for extra protection, and include that in the sale price. (maybe Guitar Center has a beat-up one for you).

Maybe you can sell via Craigs List and skip the shipping completely.

Lumpy · December 08, 2011, 06:26:03 AM

(that tremolo bar does look pretty hot)

Isabellacat · December 08, 2011, 06:40:49 AM

Got any pics of it?

liquidsmoke · December 08, 2011, 06:47:45 AM

Quote from: Lumpy on December 08, 2011, 06:26:03 AM
(that tremolo bar does look pretty hot)

Guitar players all over the net seem to think it's the ugliest thing ever made but I agree with you and the fact that it ROLLS forward when pressed is awesome.

liquidsmoke · December 08, 2011, 06:57:44 AM

Quote from: Isabellacat on December 08, 2011, 06:40:49 AM
Got any pics of it?

Not yet. I'll take some after I remove the stets and replace the pick guard. There is a blemish in the finish that was there when I bought it but otherwise it's in really good condition and has never been gigged with. I could say near mint but I'd want to look it over closely before declaring that.

Lumpy · December 08, 2011, 08:20:47 AM

Why don't you try selling it with the tremolo? New pickguard will cost money.

liquidsmoke · December 08, 2011, 01:12:53 PM

Quote from: Lumpy on December 08, 2011, 08:20:47 AM
Why don't you try selling it with the tremolo? New pickguard will cost money.

The trem was over $200, a pickguard is what, 10 or 20?

liquidsmoke · December 10, 2011, 04:14:33 PM

After pondering for awhile, I don't want a 10 pound guitar so an Agile LP is out. Will try to find an Epi '100' LP in vintage sunburst used but may end up just getting a special new.

The Shocker · December 12, 2011, 07:56:03 PM

Stupid Deal of the Day today:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/epiphone-ltd-ed-special-ii-metallic-electric-guitar/h71862000002000

It said $119 one place, maybe you have to call.

liquidsmoke · December 13, 2011, 12:15:51 AM

Quote from: deaner33 on December 12, 2011, 07:56:03 PM
Stupid Deal of the Day today:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/guitars/epiphone-ltd-ed-special-ii-metallic-electric-guitar/h71862000002000

It said $119 one place, maybe you have to call.

Good price but ugly paint.

MikeyT · December 14, 2011, 02:28:13 AM

"I have no idea how thick the neck is though. This info doesn't help me out at all-

# Width of the neck at the nut: 1 5/8"; at the 22st fret: 2 3/16"
# Neck Taper is 21.5 mm at the 1st fret and 23.5 mm at the 12th fret
# Thickness of neck at the first fret approx 11/16"

Anyone have one of these? How thick does the neck feel relative to Gibsons? Or faded SGs in particular?"

1 5/8" = 1 10/16", of course. Most Gibsons are 1 11/16" at the nut, and I believe a few are even 1 12/16".
That 1/16 of an inch does really make a difference in the feel of the guitar. Some of the 60's necks (not RI's) actually were as small as 1 1/2" at the neck [can't remember which model(s) of Gibsons or Fenders].
1 5/8" is probably as narrow as you're going to get these days.

The Epiphone Les Paul you posted the link to has the same neck width (1 5/8") as some of the Agiles; and from what I could see on the MF website, it may be the only Gibson or Epi model with a neck that narrow.
I realize it's very cheap, but I'm not so sure it would be a bad thing to have one to play around with. Use it as a modder. I'd try to get a like new used one for a very low price. If the price is really good, you can't lose.

MikeyT · December 14, 2011, 02:31:35 AM

PS
If you go Agile, get one with the 1 5/8" nut width and "slim" profile neck.
The dimensions of the "slim profile" model necks are significantly smaller than their standard necks.

liquidsmoke · December 14, 2011, 03:00:05 AM

Quote from: MikeyT on December 14, 2011, 02:28:13 AM
"I have no idea how thick the neck is though. This info doesn't help me out at all-

# Width of the neck at the nut: 1 5/8"; at the 22st fret: 2 3/16"
# Neck Taper is 21.5 mm at the 1st fret and 23.5 mm at the 12th fret
# Thickness of neck at the first fret approx 11/16"

Anyone have one of these? How thick does the neck feel relative to Gibsons? Or faded SGs in particular?"

1 5/8" = 1 10/16", of course. Most Gibsons are 1 11/16" at the nut, and I believe a few are even 1 12/16".
That 1/16 of an inch does really make a difference in the feel of the guitar. Some of the 60's necks (not RI's) actually were as small as 1 1/2" at the neck [can't remember which model(s) of Gibsons or Fenders].
1 5/8" is probably as narrow as you're going to get these days.

The Epiphone Les Paul you posted the link to has the same neck width (1 5/8") as some of the Agiles; and from what I could see on the MF website, it may be the only Gibson or Epi model with a neck that narrow.
I realize it's very cheap, but I'm not so sure it would be a bad thing to have one to play around with. Use it as a modder. I'd try to get a like new used one for a very low price. If the price is really good, you can't lose.

Thanks for the info. There is also the thickness or depth of necks as apposed to the width, do you know how Gibson '50s/'60s, Agile, Epi, etc compare on that front?

I think my cheap Epi Junior has the same neck as that Special I linked to and it's nice and fast for sure.

I've been playing my SG a lot this week and feel pretty used to it's neck size but I'd still rather it was smaller and I'm not really into it's color or the faded look anymore.