New Orange Amps

[dunwichamps]

The OD series is more or less the OR with a PPIMV but they arent known for being super pricey vintage units. I wouldnt pay over 1200 really.

[bbottom]

I played one of those tiny terror bass heads through an Ampeg 8x10 cab today.

I think that the $900 sticker price on it was high but the thing sounded pretty good.

[Hemisaurus]

It may be possible to have someone build you a tube preamp, in a small enclosure, and just couple it to a regular old Class D lightweight power amp. Which may be cheaper. But then you lose the tinyness of it, and have a pedal and a power amp.

All Orange have puported to have done is build their tube preamp, and shove a Class D power module in there.

Nick what would you charge for a two tube preamp pedal?

[Hemisaurus]

Actually a quick Google reveals Verellen have done just that, built their preamp section into a pedal, just add yer own power amp I guess.



Owch $700 does not make it cheaper than a Tiny Terror

[dunwichamps]

It may be possible to have someone build you a tube preamp, in a small enclosure, and just couple it to a regular old Class D lightweight power amp. Which may be cheaper. But then you lose the tinyness of it, and have a pedal and a power amp.

All Orange have puported to have done is build their tube preamp, and shove a Class D power module in there.

Nick what would you charge for a two tube preamp pedal?

The problem with a true tube preamp pedal is that you need a serious toroid PT that will deliver the required 300-600 mA of heater current (if you run 6.3 or 12.6V heaters) and also the 250-350V you need for the HVDC part of the power supply. So you end of needing to get custom wound toroids. I probably couldn't in parts do it cheaper than 500-600 bucks.

[Mr. Foxen]

It may be possible to have someone build you a tube preamp, in a small enclosure, and just couple it to a regular old Class D lightweight power amp. Which may be cheaper. But then you lose the tinyness of it, and have a pedal and a power amp.

All Orange have puported to have done is build their tube preamp, and shove a Class D power module in there.

Nick what would you charge for a two tube preamp pedal?

The problem with a true tube preamp pedal is that you need a serious toroid PT that will deliver the required 300-600 mA of heater current (if you run 6.3 or 12.6V heaters) and also the 250-350V you need for the HVDC part of the power supply. So you end of needing to get custom wound toroids. I probably couldn't in parts do it cheaper than 500-600 bucks.

Pulled apart one of those Blackstar HT pedals to see how they get their power sorted? Think it is 18v in and stepped up for the valve, although I've only been in broken ones.

[dunwichamps]

its all doable if you wanna dabble in some power electronics. You could easily get 300V starting with just a 12V DC supply using boost converters (switching type supplies) which is good approach since tubes dont need a lot of current. You can first get the 6.3V regulated DC heaters from the 12V tap then get ~85V by using a voltage quadrupler and floating that with the pre-regulated 12V rectified tap. I am looking to avoid having to make a pcb to do the power electronics parts.

[everdrone]

orange is coming out with 6 new amps for 2013... fingers crossed 

[Hemisaurus]

Weber make those step up transformers, 12V AC IN, 260V AC OUT. So if you had even .5A in a 12V supply, surely even RatShack have something for this.

[dunwichamps]

theres plenty of Ei core transformers but they are much larger and bulkier so it makes it hard to fit into a reasonable enclosure without sticking it on top or making an overly large enclosure (IMO). If you have 12VAC in then you first need a 120 to 12 wall wart. Id rather just stick 120V into the preamp and get what I need with 1 transformation.

Hoffman Amps has an entire setup for the wall wart + internal toroid approach.

I want to fit everything inside of a a Hammond 1590D, which has an internal dimension of around 7.2 x 4.5 x 2

[Hemisaurus]

Ah, I was looking at that Verellen, which is using a Moog style enclosure, thinking you could mount two transformers on the back panel horizontally, I've got something like that somewhere. There are project xfmrs, and flea power xfmrs, that could be fitted to that larger style of enclosure. The power xfmr for the standalone reverb unit is 2.25 thick x 3.5" wide. It would have enough juice for the job, but wouldn't be small enough for your choice of enclosure style.

It might be less costly to get an enclosure to fit the xfmr, rather than a xfmr to fit the enclosure, but this was just an excercise. Though there may be a market for an orange preamp in a pedal.

[dunwichamps]

yea if u relax the enclosure requirement, then it will become easier.

In terms of a OR or GT120 pre in a box, it would be worth it if you built the PI as well. Without the PI its not really going to get you the real feeling of either amp. Nice that the pre + pi consists of just 2 tubes which i think is doable. The only thing your left with is which PI tap to use as an output.

[Hemisaurus]

Well you could attenuate both, and use them as a balanced out. Off hand I can't think of any way you could sum them, maybe via a xfmr of some kind?

[dunwichamps]

Well you could attenuate both, and use them as a balanced out. Off hand I can't think of any way you could sum them, maybe via a xfmr of some kind?

Yes a balanced out is a nice approach. Summin wise I am not sure, would be nice if the power amp had a balanced input. If you brought the signal level down enough even op amp summers would work.

Then it would be best for a Class D setup which might need very low input impedance (compared to the average plate impedance of a 12ax7) and not a lot of input swing.

[AgentofOblivion]

A guy I know custom/hand builds clones.  My ballpark guess is he could build you an Orange-style head for <$1000 with reverb that sounds fantastic and would take around 1-2 months to make.  If you're interested then PM me and I'll send you his details.

[chille01]

Thanks Agent... I would have looked into that, if I hadn't just pulled the trigger on an OR-50 last night. Good to know the option is out there for the future though!

[clockwork green]

I finally listened to the Celebration Day stuff.  First the cd and then the movie...I thought JP had terrible tone throughout the show. Overly compressed, too much gain and that damn phaser reminded me of how much chorus ruins Rush for me. It does sound exactly like those modern Orange amps so I'd imagine his other amps were low in the mix. They just don't breathe or have the dynamic range of his old Marshall's. John Paul Jones also had terrible, modern bass tone that had no depth or growl to it.

[eoin_not_ian]

I finally listened to the Celebration Day stuff.  First the cd and then the movie...I thought JP had terrible tone throughout the show. Overly compressed, too much gain and that damn phaser reminded me of how much chorus ruins Rush for me. It does sound exactly like those modern Orange amps so I'd imagine his other amps were low in the mix. They just don't breathe or have the dynamic range of his old Marshall's. John Paul Jones also had terrible, modern bass tone that had no depth or growl to it.

Pretty much my interpretation of the bits I have heard. I'm usually quite partial to modern bass tone but that JPJ sound just had too much 'zing' to it to work well. My impression was that the Led Zep reunion had the same problems as the Cream reunion. Its sounds so damn 'safe'. All the rough edges that added to the original sound have been removed in order to achieve a cleaner more, clinical mix which is a bit bland, but palatable to the rich London types who are able to get tickets to the gig. It isn't that it sounds bad, more 'meh'.

I also generally hate chorus and phasers on guitar.

[Jake]

After reading your opinions on the acceptable amounts of compression and "zing," I have to completely change course and totally agree with you. It fuckin sucked.

[clockwork green]

Compression is great for hugs and some buttpussy lovin' but not for Zeppelin.

[Jake]

Understood.

It's weird they didn't call you up for a consult first.

[clockwork green]

I'm personally a little hurt by that...Pagey and I almost have the same initials so I thought we were close like that. You should also check with if you like stuff or not first. What if we all had our own opinions? It would be a mess of debate and hurt feelings along with the ocssional independent thinker.

[taylo)))r]

Late to the thread, but why the fuck would anyone spend 2 grand on a new orange if they want the old OR120 tone? You can get a vintage OR for less than that.

Speaking of OR120s, here is one for sale in my neck of the woods. If I already wasn't the proud pappa of a 70's Or120, I would be selling off all sorts of shit to get this.

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=218&sid=72770&ad=22962193

[dunwichamps]

wicked overpriced but a kool unit

[taylo)))r]

wicked overpriced but a kool unit

agreed.