the hot pup thread

liquidsmoke · March 13, 2012, 05:46:42 AM

Who's gone the mega hot *passive* route before? DiMarzio X2N, D Activator-X? Duncan Invader? I've used a Super D for years and liked it but want to try something hotter. Epi LP B tuned 13-59 Laney GH50 with both gain knobs on 10. I like to mix enough neck pup with the bridge to get a thick and somewhat bassy yet crushing metal tone. Chandler/Victor meets power metal?

bitter · March 13, 2012, 03:05:27 PM

My buddy has an Ibanez with the original d-activators. They honestly made no difference in how hard it hit the amp. If anything the JB pups I was rockin' did a better job. I credit that experience with why I prefer more moderate pups.

One dimarzio I would look at is the EVO? or whatever model Steve Via endorses. I knew a guy who had one in the bridge of a superstrat and it had a nice balance between driving the amp but still sounding warm (not harsh like super hot winds). The SD JB is the same way, both seem to fall into that middle ground of not being too over the top.

liquidsmoke · March 13, 2012, 10:47:10 PM

Ah. I'll check into those and consider your words. My rig sounds good with the stock Epi pups but I want more gainy chunk.

VOLVO))) · March 13, 2012, 11:06:12 PM

Meh. I have Deactivators that clockwork green sent me in my Jackson, they're nice.

high gain pickups never did it for me. I played death metal, forever, and always use the amp more than the guitar, if you know what I mean.

fizzzzzzzzz with 'em. fuck 'em.

bitter · March 13, 2012, 11:09:29 PM

Quote from: SunnO))) on March 13, 2012, 11:06:12 PM
Meh. I have Deactivators that clockwork green sent me in my Jackson, they're nice.

high gain pickups never did it for me. I played death metal, forever, and always use the amp more than the guitar, if you know what I mean.

fizzzzzzzzz with 'em. fuck 'em.

This. Plus a little boost where needed for black metal.

RacerX · March 13, 2012, 11:14:16 PM

Quote from: liquidsmoke on March 13, 2012, 10:47:10 PM
My rig sounds good with the stock Epi pups but I want more gainy chunk.

Fuck changing the pickups, then. Run your rig hot (power tubes breaking up nicely) and use a tube screamer/blues driver type pedal. Use the pedal volume control to hit the front end harder and light up the preamp toobs a bit. Adjust the pedal's tone control to dial out any fizziness. Add pedal gain if needed.

mawso · March 13, 2012, 11:43:51 PM

I always thought the SD Invader had a certain raunch I could really dig, tho not to the point that i actually wanna get one

liquidsmoke · March 14, 2012, 12:53:46 AM

Quote from: SunnO))) on March 13, 2012, 11:06:12 PM
Meh. I have Deactivators that clockwork green sent me in my Jackson, they're nice.

high gain pickups never did it for me. I played death metal, forever, and always use the amp more than the guitar, if you know what I mean.

fizzzzzzzzz with 'em. fuck 'em.

So Deactivators aren't that hot then?

VOLVO))) · March 14, 2012, 12:58:47 AM

They're hot, but not 22k hot.

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liquidsmoke · March 14, 2012, 01:02:25 AM

Quote from: RacerX on March 13, 2012, 11:14:16 PM
Quote from: liquidsmoke on March 13, 2012, 10:47:10 PM
My rig sounds good with the stock Epi pups but I want more gainy chunk.

Fuck changing the pickups, then. Run your rig hot (power tubes breaking up nicely) and use a tube screamer/blues driver type pedal. Use the pedal volume control to hit the front end harder and light up the preamp toobs a bit. Adjust the pedal's tone control to dial out any fizziness. Add pedal gain if needed.

I'm trying to avoid pedals and simply rely on the guitar and amp.

I have a Super Distortion in my Junior and I'm quite sure it's hotter than the stock pup in my LP but rather than just getting a Super D for the LP I'm thinking about something hotter as I've never owned anything hotter. The Super D is more metal sounding and I like that over more old school humbucker tone for playing metal.

I realize that this is the wrong type of forum to ask about anything having to do with non-sludgy high gain tone but this is the forum I post on and love

liquidsmoke · March 14, 2012, 01:03:40 AM

Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 12:58:47 AM
They're hot, but not 22k hot.

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Hot but not meh hot, got it. Hotter than a Super D I hope. I'll read more reviews.

bitter · March 14, 2012, 01:24:34 AM

I couldn't get my verellen to sound anymore aggressive with d-activators. Sure they are a hot design but they just made everything more sterile, thin, and harsh. The same can be aid for the JB's although they were warmer. From my very specific experience, at some point the amp just gives and it wont matter what you throw at it.

liquidsmoke · March 14, 2012, 01:29:28 AM

Quote from: bitter on March 14, 2012, 01:24:34 AM
I couldn't get my verellen to sound anymore aggressive with d-activators. Sure they are a hot design but they just made everything more sterile, thin, and harsh. The same can be aid for the JB's although they were warmer. From my very specific experience, at some point the amp just gives and it wont matter what you throw at it.

Ah. Sterile, thin, and harsh is not what I'm looking for although with the neck pup running together with the bridge I should have plenty of blasting Dave Chandler style low end.

VOLVO))) · March 14, 2012, 01:30:48 AM

Quote from: bitter on March 14, 2012, 01:24:34 AM
I couldn't get my verellen to sound anymore aggressive with d-activators. Sure they are a hot design but they just made everything more sterile, thin, and harsh. The same can be aid for the JB's although they were warmer. From my very specific experience, at some point the amp just gives and it wont matter what you throw at it.

This manwoman has it right.

You dont have to USE a pedal. Just turn the fucker on and velcro it to the amp. All you're going to do is end up sounding generic if you go hotter and hotter. If the Laney doesnt do it... it might be time...

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bitter · March 14, 2012, 01:45:01 AM

Set it and forget it.

I have found that an amp that has the gain but isn't quite metal enough generally can be helped by pedals. Not only does it push it over the top, it refines the gain and eq to add that aggressive element the amp alone can lack.

In fact, I think that was the advice I got from SunnO)) on the old board before I had the amp built.

VOLVO))) · March 14, 2012, 01:49:17 AM

I love the pushed amp high gain tone. Fuck preamp distortion.

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bitter · March 14, 2012, 01:57:00 AM

Yeah it's tasty.

Volume · March 14, 2012, 03:38:39 AM

Bareknuckle Warpigs are pretty awesome, they sound good clean or dirty. In fact I want another guitar just so I could put some warpigs in it.

mawso · March 14, 2012, 08:10:48 AM

Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 01:49:17 AM
I love the pushed amp high gain tone. Fuck preamp distortion.

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turning the gain knob up is preamp distortion.. slamming the front end with a hot pickup or with a lot of clean boost is also preamp distortion..

VOLVO))) · March 14, 2012, 11:58:55 AM

Quote from: mawso on March 14, 2012, 08:10:48 AM
Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 01:49:17 AM
I love the pushed amp high gain tone. Fuck preamp distortion.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

turning the gain knob up is preamp distortion.. slamming the front end with a hot pickup or with a lot of clean boost is also preamp distortion..

Yes, it is, but you get the real balls when your master is cranked, and the preamp is at 11oclock or noon, using a pedal. It's driving the powertubes more than the pre.

dunwichamps · March 14, 2012, 12:06:49 PM

Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 11:58:55 AM
Quote from: mawso on March 14, 2012, 08:10:48 AM
Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 01:49:17 AM
I love the pushed amp high gain tone. Fuck preamp distortion.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

turning the gain knob up is preamp distortion.. slamming the front end with a hot pickup or with a lot of clean boost is also preamp distortion..

Yes, it is, but you get the real balls when your master is cranked, and the preamp is at 11oclock or noon, using a pedal. It's driving the powertubes more than the pre.

depends on a few other factors in the amp design to know where and when you will clip. For example if you have a stage which can go into cutoff very easily then it will clip before a center biased stage will. If the phase inverter is biased very cold then you get more phase inverter and pre distortion earlier. If your input stages are very sensitive then there is not a lot of headroom they can work with before clipping even if you crank the master esp when driven hard by a pedal.

liquidsmoke · March 14, 2012, 12:12:52 PM

Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 01:30:48 AM
You dont have to USE a pedal. Just turn the fucker on and velcro it to the amp. All you're going to do is end up sounding generic if you go hotter and hotter. If the Laney doesnt do it... it might be time...

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

"Heavy metal" tones might sound generic to your ears but heavy rock/stoner/sludge/etc tones at this point in the game are not necessarily any less so. It's all been done before, a million times over, for decades now, just like heavy metal. My idea is to combine both sounds through the use of both pickups.

Do you mean to say turn the pedal on and crank the volume a bit but don't crank the gain?

The Laney "does it" for sure, no doubt. It's high gain but not muddy or ice picky the way I have it set. It's got a very clear pure tone but with a Les Paul, even a cheap Les Paul it could use a hotter bridge pup driving it.

liquidsmoke · March 14, 2012, 12:22:27 PM

Quote from: dunwichamps on March 14, 2012, 12:06:49 PM
Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 11:58:55 AM
Quote from: mawso on March 14, 2012, 08:10:48 AM
Quote from: SunnO))) on March 14, 2012, 01:49:17 AM
I love the pushed amp high gain tone. Fuck preamp distortion.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

turning the gain knob up is preamp distortion.. slamming the front end with a hot pickup or with a lot of clean boost is also preamp distortion..

Yes, it is, but you get the real balls when your master is cranked, and the preamp is at 11oclock or noon, using a pedal. It's driving the powertubes more than the pre.

depends on a few other factors in the amp design to know where and when you will clip. For example if you have a stage which can go into cutoff very easily then it will clip before a center biased stage will. If the phase inverter is biased very cold then you get more phase inverter and pre distortion earlier. If your input stages are very sensitive then there is not a lot of headroom they can work with before clipping even if you crank the master esp when driven hard by a pedal.

This is all fine and good(responding to all of the above messages), it just depends on what type of tone one wants. I want more or less the same tone at no earplug volume levels that I get at practice volume levels. I get some power tube distortion at practice but I don't need it for the sound I go for, it's just icing on the cake when it happens. Right now I actually hear more speaker distortion(which sounds a bit too Orange in my opinion) than anything when cranked but that will change after I swap speakers.

RAGER · March 14, 2012, 12:32:26 PM

Old 4 holer dimed, un-potted T-tops=bliss

VOLVO))) · March 14, 2012, 12:37:59 PM

I don't think you get it. I PLAY "heavy metal," when not playing doom. Death/thrash/black, etc. I'm not knocking the tone, I'm saying you have to have OUTSTANDING tone for me to notice it, and the same thin bullshit active pickup oversaturated gain garbage isn't that.

'
Outstanding metal tone^^^^

Outstanding metal tone^^^

OUTSTANDING METAL TONE^^^

decent^^^^

SHIT metal tone^^^^

You must realize, shitty tone follows shitty bands.